Celine F/W 2023.24 Los Angeles

[Mutterlein]

Ya'll making stuff up.

 

[Lola701]

Berge didn't sell YSL to PPR, he sold it to Sanofi in 1993 and they sold it to PPR in 1999.

Exactly. my point was really to highlight his influence. That’s why I didn’t said he sold it but point out his influence…
He had however a hard time selling the Couture because it was loosing so much money…particularly because of the huge staff PPR weren’t ready to absorb. I think they came to some sort of secret agreement however because they waited for the social plan to be settle to create the museum/foundation.

 

[yslforever]

I'm sorry but a lot of this is inaccurate. Pinault owned the couture business.


From "Yves Saint Laurent Announces Retirement" by the Associated Press Jan 7th 2002

Also, PPR also owned the beauty business. They sold it to L'Oreal in 2008.

Yes that what I said: YSL Beauty was sold to L'Oréal, PPR was endebted, but PPR was planning to be able buy it back later. That's one of the many reason Hedi Slimane returned to fashion, but PPR was never able to buy YSL beauty back because L'Oreal keeps raising their asking price. And Hedi Slimane was pissed because of L'Oreal's branding of the YSL beauty lines.

As per the "Yves Saint Laurent Haute Couture SAS" company, the one which ceased to operate in 2002, its headquarters, archives, assets and rights, they never belong to Gucci Group nor PPR nor Kering. They were in Yves' will with a clear heir, they are in Pierre Bergé's will with a clear heir and clear drastic instructions.
AP got it wrong but it's not their fault: the confusion was intentional from PPR and YSL.

 

[yslforever]

Berge didn't sell YSL to PPR, he sold it to Sanofi in 1993 and they sold it to PPR in 1999.

Bergé bought back the YSL Beauty division from Charles of the Ritz just before the first Iraq war, an event that deeply impacted many luxury and fashions houses, so they ended very much in debt. They agreed to sell to a Japanese conglomerate first until Bergé called the French president who then forced Sanofi (which had no previous expertise in fashion or perfumes) to buy YSL group for an extravagant and over-valued price BUT PB and YSL kept the couture entities and golden shares in the group.
Sanofi sold it first to Gucci Group in 1998, but PB and YSL still kept their golden shares and the couture.
Pinault discovered the goldens shares after buying Gucci Group in 1999 and there were 3 years of relentless negociations to get to a 103 pages secret agreement.
The basics are : YSL and PB got their Fondation, kept the couture but under a non compete agreement, PPR buys the golden shares for another 300 m€ and enters a 99 years contract with the new Foundation, paying royalties, and everybody keep quiet about the agreement.
But PPR went cash-trapped in 2008, sold YSL Beauty to L'Oréal, and tried to renegociate the deal with the Foundation. 3 years later the parties reached a new 67 pages agreement for 49 years.
So yes there is a secret agreement.
((there is another one, slighty less complicated, at Valentino, between the founders and the actual owners)).

 

[Mutterlein]

Yes that what I said: YSL Beauty was sold to L'Oréal, PPR was endebted, but PPR was planning to be able

Yes that what I said: YSL Beauty was sold to L'Oréal, PPR was endebted, but PPR was planning to be able buy it back later. That's one of the many reason Hedi Slimane returned to fashion, but PPR was never able to buy YSL beauty back because L'Oreal keeps raising their asking price. And Hedi Slimane was pissed because of L'Oreal's branding of the YSL beauty lines.

As per the "Yves Saint Laurent Haute Couture SAS" company, the one which ceased to operate in 2002, its headquarters, archives, assets and rights, they never belong to Gucci Group nor PPR nor Kering. They were in Yves' will with a clear heir, they are in Pierre Bergé's will with a clear heir and clear drastic instructions.
AP got it wrong but it's not their fault: the confusion was intentional from PPR and YSL.

No offense, but I'm not sure I will trust a random stranger on a message board over a New York Times published article.

 

[Lola701]

^^
In the end it’s not like we aren’t discussing things that are public knowledge for everyone that loves fashion and goes beyond the surface. What is interesting for the most part (for me at least) is to give an insight or opinion on those things…rather than expose a knowledge or give exposés…even if sometimes it can be perceived that way.

 

[Mutterlein]

^^
In the end it’s not like we aren’t discussing things that are public knowledge for everyone that loves fashion and goes beyond the surface. What is interesting for the most part (for me at least) is to give an insight or opinion on those things…rather than expose a knowledge or give exposés…even if sometimes it can be perceived that way.

"The AP is wrong."

Whatever you say whoever you are.

 

[LadyJunon]

228 days later, we finally have a full show video.

 

[kasper!]

Yves lived a really reclusive life at the time with a life between Rue de Babylone and Avenue Marceau. And Alber or Hedi weren’t Berge’s first attempt…I don’t remember his name but there was a designer in the early 90’s he was supporting and who supposedly designed the RTW…But he was a flop.

Bernard Sanz?

 

[Lola701]

Bernard Sanz?

No…Bernard Sanz wasn’t technically a flop. He was/is a menswear designer after all and at that time it didn’t had so much weight. Plus he started with Hermes at the same time as Eric Bergere. And then he went to Lanvin after YSL so…He had a moment.

‘The one I was talking about was Robert Merloz. A total flop…

 

[Bernie Flood]

Is he even a great designer?!

 

[LadyJunon]

In the wake of Slimane's rumoured departure, I find myself coming back to this show. It's typical Slimane, but the more "adult" styling of this particular show makes everything look more elegant and refined. I really liked the venue and the staging of the show too. I hope he stages a show like this again before he leaves Celine.

P.S: Can we please fix the thread title to "Celine F/W 2023.24 Los Angeles". PLEASE I BEG YOU.

 

[kasper!]

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